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chadders0's picture
chadders0/bacon HH and Theory Thread (Super Turbos)

Hey I post as chadders0 on 2p2 and bacon on this forum; this thread will be mainly ST questions which I started playing one month ago. Currently playing $50's on FTP. Looking forward to relentlessly picking the brain of mers and other people who are commited to improving their game, feel free to add me on skype (chadders0) if anyone ever wants to discuss strategy or w/e.Apologies in advance for my sentences being very long :p  No hh yet, but I guess first question off the top of my head would be about super shallow play. What do you think is the best strategy when facing a minraise around 7-10bb deep in spots where you feel there is almost no fold equity to be had by shoving. I've found there are certain opponents where this is the case and I am just shrugging and shoving because I would have called an open shove, though I think I may be missing opportunities to put another decision on my opponent and give him a chance to make a mistake.Of the top of my head other options are:Stop and go around 7bb deep when pot shove is close to pot size, would this be bad to do as deep as 10bb?Flatting and stacking off with any decent equity. Should I be more happy to do this with hands than can flop some equity well like Q9, JT over hands like ace rag? Does this strategy have the potential to become a leak by giving my opponent FE which he previously didn't have?Make an effort to mazimise whatever FE there is by making a tiny 3b and shoving any flop.Any input appreciated, thanks.  

mersenneary's picture
Welcome! There are times when

Welcome!There are times when you can fold hands you would have called an openshove with 8bb deep - Something like K3o, for example, it can be correct to call a shove but fold against a minraise. You just need very strong reads that you have no fold equity.Flatting is basically only an option with hands that flop well when you feel you have very little fold equity, so something like T8o 9bb deep against a nitty opening range. Usually stuff as strong as Q9 is best just to jam.Tiny 3bet/call is an interesting option but I think usually jamming will do better than that 7-10bb deep with playable hands.

chadders0's picture
Am i correct in thinking A2

Am i correct in thinking A2 shouldn't be in my minr/calling range? If not when should it be?I've been open shoving it up to 16bb. Above that I have been minr/folding and cbetting vs villains who either fold to steals more than 50% or haven't shown a willingness to bluff post of play marginal equity aggressively. I open shove up to 20 bb vs villains who I think will call at least as wide as nash or vs ones who may play aggressively post. Room for improvement?

 

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mersenneary's picture
Openshove up to 15 or 16 is

Openshove up to 15 or 16 is correct. If your opponent is 3bet jamming really wide it can be correct to minraise/call for 17, but usually if it's not an openjam with A2, it's a raise/fold.I wouldn't openshove 20bb deep even against aggressive villains. Against a calling range of AA-22,AK-A5,KQ-KJ,Ax4x-Ax3x,KxTx,QxJx, we're about +0.2 better than openfolding, but I expect minraise/folding still to have better expectation. You say you want to shove against opponents who call as wide as NASH, but the truth of the matter is you don't really give a care whether they call or not. With QTs, for example, it does not matter at all whether your opponent calls. You're actually hoping he folds some A3-A6/JTs stuff, while hoping he calls with things of the KTo variety. The expectation from openjamming is mostly determined by the % of monsters that you run into.

chadders0's picture
Have 3 hh off the bat, hope

Have 3 hh off the bat, hope this isnt spamming but they are pretty simple spots:  No Limit Holdem Tournament • 2 Players$50 + $1 Heads Up Sit & Go Hand converted by the official HUSNG.com hand converter BBHero470  SB666o0o_o0o999530  Effective Stacks: 24bb Blinds 10/20 Pre-Flop (30, 2 players) Hero is BB 666o0o_o0o999 raises to 40, Hero calls 20  Flop (80, 2 players) Hero checks, 666o0o_o0o999 bets 40 Final Pot: 120readless im not sure how to play this hand out to the river,  my standard is c/c flop, how often should i be calling double barrels vs regs and vs fish, does my plan alter for turns Jack or ten? Do you think there could be merit in donking blank turns readless?The next hand felt pretty dirty, but villain is a reg who I would give some credit for being competent, in the moment I just recalled how I would take villains line with with kings or turned two pairs and decided to fold. I have come accross a few people who c/c flop then donk donk with air but these seem to be the fishier players.  I guess this is more of just a thumbs up or thumbs down one, though if you have any thoughts on adjustments/counter strats vs players who c/c flops and donk turns regularly they would also be welcome.  No Limit Holdem Tournament • 2 Players$50 + $1 Heads Up Sit & Go Hand converted by the official HUSNG.com hand converter BBluckych08430  SBHero570  Effective Stacks: 14bb Blinds 15/30 Pre-Flop (45, 2 players) Hero is SB Hero raises to 60, luckych08 calls 30    Flop (120, 2 players) luckych08 checks, Hero bets 60, luckych08 calls 60    Turn (240, 2 players) luckych08 bets 120, Hero folds  Final Pot: 360This last one is as to whether the vbet on the river is too thin, in a turbo husng i would have likely checked back river but would i be right in saying people are more likely to make crying calls in STs or do I need some kind of assertive read that villain will stack off with a T here to value bet this. No Limit Holdem Tournament • 2 Players$50 + $1 Heads Up Sit & Go Hand converted by the official HUSNG.com hand converter SBHero510  BBkhanal490  Effective Stacks: 25bb Blinds 10/20 Pre-Flop (30, 2 players) Hero is SB Hero raises to 40, khanal calls 20    Flop (80, 2 players) khanal checks, Hero bets 40, khanal calls 40    Turn (160, 2 players) khanal checks, Hero bets 100, khanal calls 100    River (360, 2 players) khanal checks, Hero goes all-in 330    Final Pot: 690 

 

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chadders0's picture
Even after 1 day of using

Even after 1 day of using this site its become abundantly clear to me that this was sooooo worth the money :)

 

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mersenneary's picture
"Even after 1 day of using

"Even after 1 day of using this site its become abundantly clear to me that this was sooooo worth the money :)"Yeah, I think this is a ton more valuable (with all of the resources and all the things the community provides) than an hour of coaching or something like that.

mersenneary's picture
So, the 98 hand is in a

So, the 98 hand is in a classification where it FEELS awkward, but most of the time, it's not and you forget about it. Most of the time after you correctly c/c flop (really your only option pretty much always except in a sick inducing dynamic), villain will check turn. And we forget about those times for the most part, and just think about how uncomfortable getting barreled is. I'm calling a turn bet readless I think on every turn card, although folding to some potsized bets on like a J or a T (despite picking up extra equity), I think we can probably c/f to pot on blank turns as well. These aren't boards that people bluff very often, but it's enough for us to continue readless. There are a lot of nitty regs who I'm folding to against a normal sized turn bet without a second thought because their ranges are just that imbalanced.

mersenneary's picture
I'm not a fan of folding the

I'm not a fan of folding the JJ without extreme reads there. I do agree it's generally a value-y line, but there are some draws and even some worse made hands that will do this. Sure, he doesn't rep a ton for bluff, but I also expect people to c/r their Kx on the flop a decent bit with the flush draw out there. T9 is the hand I'd be most afraid of - it's a perfect hand to flat at this stack depth, check/call flop, and lead this turn. But that's the only two pair hand that really makes sense, and we have 27% against it anyway.

mersenneary's picture
I would c-bet the J8 bigger

I would c-bet the J8 bigger as standard, no need to balance against most. Hmm on river bet. I expect you to have the best hand the vast majority of the time, and yeah with only 310 effective on river, jamming is probably best. Spade and straight draws missed so he has to think about looking you up with Tx. Most players you'll here from on flop, turn, or river with better Jx, 9x, or a flush.

chadders0's picture
No Limit Holdem Tournament •

No Limit Holdem Tournament • 2 Players$50 + $1 Heads Up Sit & Go Hand converted by the official HUSNG.com hand converter SBDanielGeneve545  BBHero455  Effective Stacks: 15bb Blinds 15/30 Pre-Flop (45, 2 players) Hero is BB DanielGeneve calls 15, Hero raises to 90, DanielGeneve calls 60    Flop (180, 2 players)    Final Pot: 180Hero?Villain has been limping a lot, in our last game he limp folded every time I raised. This is our second game and my first oop raise that wasnt a shove. The flop is close to as bad as it gets but from gameflow I think there is no chance he will bluff over a lead in this spot, however I'm not sure if he may attempt to bluff if I check to him. My instinct is to bet/fold just under half pot, though in hindsight I'm not sure if this is right in this particular spot (given with the board and the gameflow there is imo no worse hands with he can flat me with other than maybe FD). Is c/c up to half pot then c/f to another bet good here or should I just stick to having the initiative?edit; i guess the advantage of betting over checking here is that it folds out Tx Jx that may spike a pair on turn though still not sure which is optimal.  

 

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mersenneary's picture
Against the opponent as it

Against the opponent as it seems like, I'd just check/fold. Sounds like a passive opponent who won't stab here with air very much, we have blockers to T9/J9 hands he might stab, and he can definitely have Kx/Qx. He should have far more combos of those than flush draws.From what it sounds like, if I do c-bet this flop, it's literally going to be like t50-t60. That's all we need to accomplish what we want to accomplish against a straightforward opponent.

chadders0's picture
I think I just hit a wisdom

I think I just hit a wisdom nugget, I don't think I ever see people limp to trap after losing a pot where they invest 3bb or more i.e. when they can rep tilt, so I've been religously shoving over limps after winning allins and it is yet to fail once (touch wood). Only been playing the 50s a few days after prev playing 20/35s, there are are significantly more competent regs and a lot who play consistently, I wanna work on my reg on reg game so I was thinking I could pick a couple regs where I have decent sample with and post their stats an tendancies and some of their hh (to get a better idea of their game, not for individual analysis) so that we could discuss the adjustments that I should be making to better exploit them, seem like a good idea?

 

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mersenneary's picture
Interesting about the limps.

Interesting about the limps. I think that makes sense.Sounds like a great idea about regs.

chadders0's picture
No Limit Holdem Tournament •

No Limit Holdem Tournament • 2 Players$50 + $1 Heads Up Sit & Go Hand converted by the official HUSNG.com hand converter BBO SH1ZL GZNGAHR620  SBHero380  Effective Stacks: 13bb Blinds 15/30 Pre-Flop (45, 2 players) Hero is SB Hero calls 15, O SH1ZL GZNGAHR checks Flop (60, 2 players) O SH1ZL GZNGAHR checks, Hero bets 60, O SH1ZL GZNGAHR calls 60 Turn (180, 2 players) O SH1ZL GZNGAHR checks, Hero ?? Final Pot: 180 Wasn't sure to double barrel here or not. Don't think many 6's c/c flop, his 4x 3x and 5x prob do but im not sure if i can get value from 3x on the turn. villain was a bit of a fish but didnt have reqds as to whether he would play a FD aggro, im thinkin it would be likely on this flop given he would like have two overs or a gutshot to go with a  FD if he did have one. I think i prefer a check and calling a bet on most blank rivers, I expect a lead from 4s and some 5s and with the two 4's out he should have twice as many naked 5's in his range than 4s right?

 

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mersenneary's picture
Limp pre is somewhat marginal

Limp pre is somewhat marginal - I'd usually raise/fold pre rather than let so much 82o stuff into the pot for free, but it can be correct given reads that villain is more passive. I like the bigger sizing against most on the flop. I'd just bet/call turn. The fact that he has a lot more 3x/5x in his range than 7x/4x meakes it a bet/call. We can get value out of those hands, I don't think even bottom pair likes folding on this turn. You will get value from river bluffs from 5x sometimes, but you'll also get value from it by betting turn.

chadders0's picture
calling open shoves with high middling hands

Dont do much on sundays cos they are rigged so just a quick question because i'm not sure if i'm nitty with open shoves with high middling hands;Is there any situations when we should call off j9 and q8 wider than nash (just under 10bb) to open shoves?How deep should we be stacking off with QJ, QT, JT (I think i may be a little nitty when it comes to calling open shoves with these hands) to say a 40%, 55% and 85% opener. Is the decision to stack off these hands to open shoves affected by someone minr/calling polarised and shoving good hands that dony play post (Ax, small pairs, suited connectors), at a guess I think we can call a little wider if this is the case because we will be dominated less. Oh and I forgot to mention my wisdom nugget of shoving over limps after villain loses 4bb pot I only used around 18bb eff or less.

 

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mersenneary's picture
J9 and Q8 become wider than

J9 and Q8 become wider than NASH calls once you see your opponent start to consistently make incorrect shoves that are too deep, they play really well against that too-wide type stuff.I think readless, QJo is a call of an openshove 12bb deep, QTo 11bb deep, JTo 10bb deep, or around there. Most opps don't shove as wide as NASH. It's definitely seriously affected by the fact that most people's openshoving range tends to be Ax/pps/connected stuff and will minraise KQ/KJ/premium pairs, etc.

chadders0's picture
When you say it's definately

When you say it's definately affected I assume you mean I can call the open shoves a bit wider? say around 13bb for QT, JT, QJ since I know i'm rarely dominated.

 

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mersenneary's picture
Yeah, if you have strong

Yeah, if you have strong reads, you can call wider, especially in combination with the reads that they'll jam weaker connected stuff.

chadders0's picture
having trouble with an

having trouble with an opponent who is a 3bet maniac, he is a reg at my stake and has a 3bet % of 48% over a couple of hundred hand sample. A lot of the shoves are coming in the 20-25bb deep range, I know he is happy shoving KJo to minr first hand as standard and probably weak aces too but I havent seen too much of his range as I am obv folding a lot. he flats oop around 20%, and basically NEVER c/r the flop. when he raises pre he only cbets 50% of the time, i think he does the standard c back with high cards bottom pair and bet no SD and top pair.at around the 10-13bb He minraises to induce with hands that are imo open shoves given my own 3b tendanceies, stuff like a6, q8.he open 75%he rarely limps. I think in genereal his play post flop is suprisingly unaggressive compared to his preflop play. so at a guess my adjustments should be:Barrel a lot on ace and king high boards since his flattin range is mostly middling hands.Donk more low boards, to force difficult decisions with his A high btm pair type hands.3b shove more in the 17-22bb range.I'm having trouble with preflp adjustments, I did some stove with a wider 3b range and I figure even if i give him 22-99 all aces and and some high kx i still cant really open up my calling range much past a7o in the first level (im guessin his 3b range must be wider given the % but that all iv seen so far from results).  I feel like I should be able to call much wider given his 3b%,which is 50 even at the first level. i guess half of this could just be a case of me running into a bunch of hands against an already extra aggressive opponent, i will def be playing him more to find out, forgot to take not of his raise limp stats so will be reporting back with that too at some point.some of this is just thinkng aloud, but kinda laying the foundations for further discussion on this reg who i will clock as many hands as poss with because it seems to me his over aggression is a major leak but i dont know how to capitalise on it properly. 

 

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mersenneary's picture
"I think in genereal his play

"I think in genereal his play post flop is suprisingly unaggressive compared to his preflop play."This is all a great recipe for developing a middling limping range and a polarized raising range. That's the very first adjustment I'd make against this type of opponent.

chadders0's picture
ok, so say for example i have

ok, so say for example i have come up with the range I'm happy to stack off with, probably around the top 17%, should I aim to go for an even weighting of junk hands or have hands weighted more to junk (basically do I want to be inconsistent with the junk I open, and open fold?).in this spot will a hand like 56o be considerend junk or limp worthy? I normally would weight it to r/f (after your comment on the 67 hand) but if im lookin to have a pfr or around 40% then there is enough worse junk i can r/f so is it ok to limp this, or is it always a no no given the lack of SD value? middling hands, does that mean middle strngth or two middle cards? cos im not sure if i  should put some of the weak aces and kings that im not happy to r/f in my limping range at 18-25bb ( my guess is this is ok). is my adjustment of a wider donking range correct in response to: "i think he does the standard c back with high cards bottom pair and bet no SD and top pair."

 

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mersenneary's picture
I'd have an openfolding

I'd have an openfolding range, too, if he's playing 68% of hands OOP. 56o I'd probably raise/fold, 54o I'd just openfold.I wouldn't put Kx or Ax in your limping range 18-25bb deep, mostly it's going to be midding cards that can't raise/call but often can limp/call.I do think a wider donking range is good in that situation.

chadders0's picture
No Limit Holdem Tournament •

No Limit Holdem Tournament • 2 Players$50 + $1 Heads Up Sit & Go Hand converted by the official HUSNG.com hand converter BBgodolob500  SBHero500  Effective Stacks: 25bb Blinds 10/20 Pre-Flop (30, 2 players) Hero is SB Hero raises to 40, godolob calls 20 Flop (80, 2 players) godolob checks, Hero bets 40, godolob raises to 110, Hero calls 70 Turn (300, 2 players) godolob bets 225, Hero folds Final Pot: 525 godolob wins 525 ( won +150 ) Hero lost -1502nd match vs nitty fish, one of the few times i should fold top pair?

 

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chadders0's picture
No Limit Holdem Tournament •

No Limit Holdem Tournament • 2 Players$50 + $1 Heads Up Sit & Go Hand converted by the official HUSNG.com hand converter SBHero510  BBMissKiss080490  Effective Stacks: 25bb Blinds 10/20 Pre-Flop (30, 2 players) Hero is SB Hero raises to 40, MissKiss080 calls 20   Flop (80, 2 players) MissKiss080 checks, Hero bets 35, MissKiss080 goes all-in 450, Hero folds   Final Pot: 565 MissKiss080 wins 565 ( won +75 ) Hero lost -75   im not sure why i bet 35 instead of 40 on the flop.is this a fine fold vs avg population in your opinion.would our decision change if there was a FD on the board?   

 

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chadders0's picture
No Limit Holdem Tournament •

No Limit Holdem Tournament • 2 Players$50 + $1 Heads Up Sit & Go Hand converted by the official HUSNG.com hand converter SBHero480  BBNemo_007007520  Effective Stacks: 24bb Blinds 10/20 Pre-Flop (30, 2 players) Hero is SB Hero raises to 40, Nemo_007007 calls 20 Flop (80, 2 players) Nemo_007007 checks, Hero bets 40, Nemo_007007 calls 40 Turn (160, 2 players) Nemo_007007 checks, Hero bets 100, Nemo_007007 calls 100 River (360, 2 players) Nemo_007007 checks, Hero checksYou think we can ship for thin v here readless? Turn would have been a bet/call right?

 

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mersenneary's picture
We can actually fold the flop

We can actually fold the flop against some supernits with the K4, but yes, once you get to this turn against a nit who never has anything worse than a king or a flush draw that got there, it's a fold.A5 hand is really close, I've honestly wondered myself a lot about this spot. I usually call. I definitely call if there's a flush draw.I'd bet river with the 89, yes. I think t160 is probably better than shipping. If he jams turn, we do have to call.

chadders0's picture
forgot to schedule sweat, how

forgot to schedule sweat, how do i go about that, i dont mind if its more conveniant to put off until next month because I have a lot of grinding to get done also.

 

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mersenneary's picture
My schedule is a bit up in

My schedule is a bit up in the air, very busy next week. I can do the 5pm GMT time slot (10am my time) if that happens to work for you.

chadders0's picture
cannot find calender in

cannot find calender in question, what day is that? should be fine for that one unless next month is better for u, im fine either way.

 

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chadders0's picture
No Limit Holdem Tournament •

No Limit Holdem Tournament • 2 Players$50 + $1 Heads Up Sit & Go Hand converted by the official HUSNG.com hand converter SBLangM20480  BBHero520  Effective Stacks: 16bb Blinds 15/30 Pre-Flop (45, 2 players) Hero is BB LangM20 raises to 60, Hero calls 30 Flop (120, 2 players) Hero checks, LangM20 bets 60, Hero goes all-in 460, LangM20 goes all-in 360 Turn (1000, 2 players, 2 all-in) River (1000, 2 players, 2 all-in) Final Pot: 1000 Is there a better line for me to take readless?

 

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chadders0's picture
No Limit Holdem Tournament •

No Limit Holdem Tournament • 2 Players$50 + $1 Heads Up Sit & Go Hand converted by the official HUSNG.com hand converter BBPokerstorm1980480  SBHero520  Effective Stacks: 16bb Blinds 15/30 Pre-Flop (45, 2 players) Hero is SB Hero raises to 60, Pokerstorm1980 calls 30 Flop (120, 2 players) Pokerstorm1980 checks, Hero bets 60, Pokerstorm1980 calls 60 Turn (240, 2 players) Pokerstorm1980 checks, Hero bets 120, Pokerstorm1980 goes all-in 360, Hero calls 240 Final Pot: 960 relatively readless

 

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chadders0's picture
No Limit Holdem Tournament •

No Limit Holdem Tournament • 2 Players$50 + $1 Heads Up Sit & Go Hand converted by the official HUSNG.com hand converter SBbikkule510  BBHero490  Effective Stacks: 25bb Blinds 10/20 Pre-Flop (30, 2 players) Hero is BB bikkule raises to 40, Hero calls 20 Flop (80, 2 players) Hero checks, bikkule checks Turn (80, 2 players) Hero bets 50, bikkule calls 50 River (180, 2 players) Hero bets 100, bikkule goes all-in 420, Hero folds Final Pot: 700 bikkule wins 700 ( won +190 ) Hero lost -190Feels like super standard fold readless, im just wondering if there is a threshold for pot odds where this, or a situation like this may be a bet call.( say for ex if i bet 80 into 120 with 100 behind do i still fold?)

 

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mersenneary's picture
Any day for that time slot

Any day for that time slot this week works for me.Readless, I think your line with the JT is best by a good margin. We need to know that our opponent isn't raising/cbetting much before we can consider just calling the flop.I'd likely bet/call just a bit bigger with the KJ, not fun to get jammed on, but J9/96 are really the only hands that make a lot of sense, and there's plenty more worse holdings to get value out of.I agree the Kx is a standard fold, I think when he shoves for like 160 more we'd probably have to call it off just because people will occasionally do ridiculous things and top pair is hard to make.

chadders0's picture
No Limit Holdem Tournament •

No Limit Holdem Tournament • 2 Players$50 + $1 Heads Up Sit & Go Hand converted by the official HUSNG.com hand converter BBHero655  SBit5tricky345  Effective Stacks: 9bb Blinds 20/40 Pre-Flop (60, 2 players) Hero is BB it5tricky calls 20, Hero checks Flop (80, 2 players) Hero bets 40, it5tricky calls 40 Turn (160, 2 players) Hero bets 80, it5tricky calls 80 River (320, 2 players) Hero bets 240, it5tricky folds Final Pot: 560 Hero wins 560 ( won +160 ) it5tricky lost -160 bet/call turn all day?river good thin value? i see no queens or 9s in his range and my line probably looks a  bit polarised so may get called light i think (no specific reads of vilain being calling station though iirc)

 

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mersenneary's picture
I think c/r flop is going to

I think c/r flop is going to be the best line against most. We should expect him to c-bet with his air and get it in vs his pairs this way. As played, I'd bet turn bigger, and am fine with jamming this river.

chadders0's picture
^cbet? he limped. I normally

^cbet? he limped. I normally go for c/r in limped pots if villain seems regish or they have bet limped pots prev, never really do it readless...a leak?

 

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mersenneary's picture
Yeah, saw the limp. I think

Yeah, saw the limp. I think it is a leak to just assume most people don't bet in position with a fairly wide range here.

chadders0's picture
ah ok cool,  will take friday

ah ok cool, will take friday sweat if that still available.

 

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mersenneary's picture
Sure, booked.

Sure, booked.

chadders0's picture
No Limit Holdem Tournament •

No Limit Holdem Tournament • 2 Players$50 + $1 Heads Up Sit & Go Hand converted by the official HUSNG.com hand converter BBrktomita1980590  SBHero410  Effective Stacks: 21bb Blinds 10/20 Pre-Flop (30, 2 players) Hero is SB Hero raises to 40, rktomita1980 calls 20 Flop (80, 2 players) rktomita1980 bets 60, Hero goes all-in 370, rktomita1980 folds Final Pot: 510 Hero wins 510 ( won +100 ) rktomita1980 lost -100Villain was tyhe type that i could assume no ace in his range because he would have shoved pre, in this spot i think its v unlikely he is donking a Jc so seemed like an auto shove here was the most +ev line.

 

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No Limit Holdem Tournament •

No Limit Holdem Tournament • 2 Players$50 + $1 Heads Up Sit & Go Hand converted by the official HUSNG.com hand converter SBHero530  BBBinacaman470  Effective Stacks: 24bb Blinds 10/20 Pre-Flop (30, 2 players) Hero is SB Hero raises to 40, Binacaman calls 20   Flop (80, 2 players) Binacaman bets 80, Hero goes all-in 490, Binacaman goes all-in 350   Turn (1000, 2 players, 2 all-in)   River (1000, 2 players, 2 all-in)   Think i hate my play this hand, people dont often pot donk then fold to a raise on wet flops and i expect to see at least a pair here i think.So as for other lines, im a bit stuck, i dont know if flattin 1 st to hit one of our outs is lol bad, and it may have no value given we may have an obv straight if we do hit.Fold seems yuk, but may have merits, i'm not sure. 

 

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chadders0's picture
No Limit Holdem Tournament •

No Limit Holdem Tournament • 2 Players$50 + $1 Heads Up Sit & Go Hand converted by the official HUSNG.com hand converter BBredfield47500  SBHero500  Effective Stacks: 25bb Blinds 10/20 Pre-Flop (30, 2 players) Hero is SB Hero raises to 40, redfield47 calls 20   Flop (80, 2 players) redfield47 checks, Hero bets 40, redfield47 calls 40   Turn (160, 2 players) redfield47 checks, Hero bets 100, redfield47 calls 100   River (360, 2 players) redfield47 checks, Hero??  Readless, at a guess i feel i likely have the best hand but there is really only 3 tens that pay me off, so maybe small, like t100, fold to shove. 

 

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chadders0's picture
No Limit Holdem Tournament •

No Limit Holdem Tournament • 2 Players$50 + $1 Heads Up Sit & Go Hand converted by the official HUSNG.com hand converter BBredfield47515  SBHero485  Effective Stacks: 16bb Blinds 15/30 Pre-Flop (45, 2 players) Hero is SB Hero calls 15, redfield47 raises to 60, Hero calls 30 Flop (120, 2 players) redfield47 checks, Hero bets 90, redfield47 calls 90  Villain was lettin me limp and take postflop a lot so was limping most hands, this hand he minr so i call, my plan on this board is to shove over any cbet of his or 3/4 pot and basically gii on turn. This is all hunky dory right?If the flop was super dry, say k72, would it be a good idea to alter to maybe flattin his cbet or betting only half pot on flop if checked to given his gii range that we beat will proabably be a lot narrower.

 

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chadders0's picture
No Limit Holdem Tournament •

No Limit Holdem Tournament • 2 Players$50 + $1 Heads Up Sit & Go Hand converted by the official HUSNG.com hand converter BBHero650  SBgrapped350  Effective Stacks: 18bb Blinds 10/20 Pre-Flop (30, 2 players) Hero is BB grapped raises to 40, Hero calls 20   Flop (80, 2 players) Hero checks, grapped bets 40, Hero raises to 120, grapped calls 80   Turn (320, 2 players) Hero bets 190, grapped folds   Final Pot: 510 Hero wins 510 ( won +160 ) grapped lost -160Just wondering if c/shove or c/r/c shove any turn is the best line, is there much to be gained from the giving the illusion of some FE in this spot?  

 

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mersenneary's picture
I would probably flat with

I would probably flat with the Tc. You're right that he only really has the Jc in terms of better clubs, but our equity is really mediocre against Qx/Jx, and unless you have previous reads of weak hands in his donking range, I think it's a call against the general population. Once you know he can bluffdonk here a jam becomes best, but I don't think most people have air ranges that are too wide here."Think i hate my play this hand, people dont often pot donk then fold to a raise on wet flops and i expect to see at least a pair here i think."See, this is weird to me, as I don't think there's that big of a difference between pot and 3/4 (it matters, but not so much that your opinion should be drastically changed. We also have an overcard here (although our draw is weaker because it can be more easily dominated. I think they're pretty similar situations. I don't think folding is an option, especially with the backdoor flush draw (but not folding anyway). I think jamming and flatting are very close here.       

chadders0's picture
I think i may have been a bit

I think i may have been a bit of a results orientated fish with the k8 hand, i just realised the two first hands i posted were basically the same spots and i've argued a different line for both of them lol, guess fishes like me just love flush draws more than straight draws.

 

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mersenneary's picture
Well, as I was coaching my

Well, as I was coaching my friend who is in town for the next couple of days, a flush is better than a straight on the hand rankings.I can't believe the info I give away for free.

chadders0's picture
No Limit Holdem Tournament •

No Limit Holdem Tournament • 2 Players$50 + $1 Heads Up Sit & Go Hand converted by the official HUSNG.com hand converter SBHero430  BBjamaal3570  Effective Stacks: 22bb Blinds 10/20 Pre-Flop (30, 2 players) Hero is SB Hero calls 10, jamaal3 checks Flop (40, 2 players) jamaal3 bets 40, Hero calls 40 Turn (120, 2 players) jamaal3 checks, Hero bets 60, jamaal3 goes all-in 510, Hero folds Final Pot: 690 jamaal3 wins 690 ( won +120 ) Hero lost -120wasnt sure whether to bet turn here or not, and whether its a bet call or bet fold.  Any thoughts on the k3, k4 hand.

 

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mersenneary's picture
I play the Q5 hand the exact

I play the Q5 hand the exact same way, nh.My comment on the K4 hands got deleted! Boo. I completely agree with your analysis on the first K4 hand. Check/raising is going to be best against most for the K4, not check/jamming. We want to keep some air in our range so he can jam over with weaker holdings. There are some people who literally never do that though, and check/jam is better against them.

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