Personally, I don't value the HEM red line at all. It's based off of EV, which is only a +/- figure when both hands are shown and the hand gets to showdown, which may happen a lot of times in matches, or may only happen once or twice. To me, there are many other plays (good or bad) made throughout the game in which EV can't be calculated since you don't know exactly what your opponent had. IMO, the red line is pretty much not useful based on lack of information (in terms of +/- EV) for the better part of each match. Unless your red line is somewhere crazy far away from your green line, in which case I can then see a situation where you can gather that you're running good or bad. But if it's only marginally apart from your green line, then I don't even pay attention to it, and I generally uncheck it so it's not even there. Who cares how I "should" be doing, all that matters is how I'm ACTUALLY doing and, of course there is variance and you can run good or bad, but that's why you play 1000's of matches at a level before you can really determine if you're profitable at it. My two cents..... JB
So u just play 1000 matchez at your lvl without knowing if you are playing well or terible at all and how much of your losses/wins are based on pure variance? I am not whining about the money i should have won i just need to know am i doing well and to keep playing that way or i must change someth in my game(without lvling much) :)And how u define crazy away form green line? is 26-27 BI qualify for that?
I don't really analyze it that way. I just follow strict BR management and if I make enough to move up to the next level then I do, and if I need to drop down then I do. I have been playing for a long time and I have a pretty clear idea of whether or not I'm playing well or not based on the reads I make and what villain turns up with. If I see I'm making clearly stupid reads or plays, then I take a break for a day or two and think things over and then go back to work. I don't need a line to tell me I'm running good or bad. Mostly because I don't believe that line tells you a whole lot, based on the fact that it uses maybe 10% (give or take) of the information from the match. If you need some software (or someone) to tell you you're running good or bad, then you may want to employ the services of a coach. Just my opinion, to each their own though......GL -JB
I thought the HEM redline was non-showdown winnings rather than EV...? Obviously not in the posted graph, but when someone refers to there redline, isn't that generally non-showdown winnings?
@qattack - Whenever I hear 'redline' I automatically assume non showdown winnings.I just made the switch to HU sngs and am pretty sure it's normally just labeled as your expected EV line
Think it is more important to review the critical hands of the match and then grade yourself on your performance. Just look at HEM ev gives you a distorted view. You will see lots of times you made a good decision that was wrong. Look at how badly the redline looks if you go allin wiith an under set.
i have always been confused by the red line because it seems if u get blinded down to say 500 early on and then win with 30% equity then get back to even stacks and lose an 80 20 you dont seem to have great adjusted ev. other question is since it doesnt show non showdown winnings does that mean that good players should actually be a good bit above ev if they are not running terrible?also is a player who bluffs a lot more likely to be over ev because you get $0 ev when you bluff off a stack?
I don't know the technical analysis off hand, but players can definitely have "bad" red lines and be running good and vice versa. Red line is better than results as an indicator of winrate, but it's not perfect, particularly in the short term.
Can I trust this picture that I play well and beat the games or the red line is not accurate enough? http://img510.imageshack.us/i/61036707.jpg/
Personally, I don't value the HEM red line at all. It's based off of EV, which is only a +/- figure when both hands are shown and the hand gets to showdown, which may happen a lot of times in matches, or may only happen once or twice. To me, there are many other plays (good or bad) made throughout the game in which EV can't be calculated since you don't know exactly what your opponent had. IMO, the red line is pretty much not useful based on lack of information (in terms of +/- EV) for the better part of each match. Unless your red line is somewhere crazy far away from your green line, in which case I can then see a situation where you can gather that you're running good or bad. But if it's only marginally apart from your green line, then I don't even pay attention to it, and I generally uncheck it so it's not even there. Who cares how I "should" be doing, all that matters is how I'm ACTUALLY doing and, of course there is variance and you can run good or bad, but that's why you play 1000's of matches at a level before you can really determine if you're profitable at it. My two cents..... JB
So u just play 1000 matchez at your lvl without knowing if you are playing well or terible at all and how much of your losses/wins are based on pure variance? I am not whining about the money i should have won i just need to know am i doing well and to keep playing that way or i must change someth in my game(without lvling much) :)And how u define crazy away form green line? is 26-27 BI qualify for that?
I don't really analyze it that way. I just follow strict BR management and if I make enough to move up to the next level then I do, and if I need to drop down then I do. I have been playing for a long time and I have a pretty clear idea of whether or not I'm playing well or not based on the reads I make and what villain turns up with. If I see I'm making clearly stupid reads or plays, then I take a break for a day or two and think things over and then go back to work. I don't need a line to tell me I'm running good or bad. Mostly because I don't believe that line tells you a whole lot, based on the fact that it uses maybe 10% (give or take) of the information from the match. If you need some software (or someone) to tell you you're running good or bad, then you may want to employ the services of a coach. Just my opinion, to each their own though......GL -JB
I thought the HEM redline was non-showdown winnings rather than EV...? Obviously not in the posted graph, but when someone refers to there redline, isn't that generally non-showdown winnings?
@qattack - Whenever I hear 'redline' I automatically assume non showdown winnings.I just made the switch to HU sngs and am pretty sure it's normally just labeled as your expected EV line
Think it is more important to review the critical hands of the match and then grade yourself on your performance. Just look at HEM ev gives you a distorted view. You will see lots of times you made a good decision that was wrong. Look at how badly the redline looks if you go allin wiith an under set.
Yeah non-showdown winnings is only for cash games in HEM
i have always been confused by the red line because it seems if u get blinded down to say 500 early on and then win with 30% equity then get back to even stacks and lose an 80 20 you dont seem to have great adjusted ev. other question is since it doesnt show non showdown winnings does that mean that good players should actually be a good bit above ev if they are not running terrible?also is a player who bluffs a lot more likely to be over ev because you get $0 ev when you bluff off a stack?
I don't know the technical analysis off hand, but players can definitely have "bad" red lines and be running good and vice versa. Red line is better than results as an indicator of winrate, but it's not perfect, particularly in the short term.