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Not Brunson's picture
$330 flopped boat against a fish - enough value?
 
PokerStars Game #27946514087: Tournament #161910040, $330+$15 Hold'em No Limit - Match Round I, Level I (10/20) - 2009/05/07 22:30:03 CT [2009/05/07 23:30:03 ET]
Table '161910040 1' 2-max Seat #1 is the button
Seat 1: Hero (1490 in chips) 
Seat 2: messier111 (1510 in chips) 
Hero: posts small blind 10
messier111: posts big blind 20
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Hero [7h 7c]
Hero: raises 40 to 60
messier111: raises 140 to 200
Hero: calls 140
*** FLOP *** [6c 7s 6s]
messier111: checks 
Hero: checks 
*** TURN *** [6c 7s 6s] [Qs]
messier111: checks 
Hero: bets 250
messier111: calls 250
*** RIVER *** [6c 7s 6s Qs] [5c]
messier111: checks 
Hero: bets 1040 and is all-in
 
It's been an aggressive match, and this guy has 3 bet me a couple times already. He is a very profitable 9 man sng player, but is a fish hu according to sharkscope. Obviously, I'm just looking for value here. Do you like the pot sized shove on the river? 
xSCWx's picture
I like the shove on the

I like the shove on the river but I think you should be betting the flop. I'd expect people to check/call you a lot more often than they are going to check/fold and you might even induce a raise from him.
I'd bet the flop to whatever I think AK will call.

RyPac13's picture
I like what xSCWx

I like what xSCWx said.
It's an interesting difference in what you would do if he had just flat called you preflop, but with the raise PF and the flop check, a lot of players that are mostly 3-betting for value are going to be calling or raising your flop bet with most, if not all, of their range.
The bad guys that 3-bet with a lot of junk usually will lead in these spots too, so I'm not seeing a check fold very often against this guy, leading me to agree with xSCWx here.
The rest of the hand becomes very fun to play in these situations as well, though many (myself included) get too fancy at times on turns and rivers.

magnusnick's picture
I can't believe you just

I can't believe you just called messier111 a fish :)))) Hilarious.

cymonguk's picture
Primo

Tells me I have FPS ( Fancy Play Syndrome) 

RyPac13's picture
Yea, doesn't appear to be a

Yea, doesn't appear to be a husng fish even!

messier111        
2,062
$4  
$531  
0%
$7,765  

 
Anybody that beats the rake at the $500 buyin (these are filtered for turbos) is probably not a fish unless they are playing 1k+.

Skates's picture
 I promise, he's v. good

 I promise, he's v. good HU.

redgrape's picture
You should bet the flop

You should bet the flop


Skates's picture
erm, hero can absolutely

erm, hero can absolutely check the flop if meta's right.  I know I'm not usually checking flop b/c I keep my image is usually that I keep aggression up and can bet air/draws there all day.... messier11 more often than not will play for stacks here with AK against me.  However, if you jump up another level, I won't be betting draws, so then I only have the nuts, so then messier should c/f everything, so circular logic as always.
It's actually pretty spewy to bet draws here vs. messier (in a nutshell) so I'd argue that checking is fine for balance.
If board was rainbow, you should basically always bet.