Thinking Like a Winner: An Introductory Series (Part 4)
Submitted by waldie191 on November 5, 2011 - 04:27
In part 4 of the Thinking Like a Winner series, Waldie reviews play of HUSNG member Jakester at the $30 turbo level. He talks about playing a vulnerable top pair hand on the flop and navigating latter streets in a larger pot.
Submitted by waldie191 on November 8, 2011 - 15:08.
When we 3 bet here, we are 3-betting for value because he likely calls too wide facing 3 bets and our hand is strong AND flops VERY well. However if the opponent 4 bets us here, I ,personally, would snap fold.
We've only played 5 hands with no past history, and usually a random opponents' 4 betting range 50 BBs deep crushes KQ (even if its a small size (sometimes VERY VERY strong)). We pretty much can't beat anything if he shoves. 22-AA have us beat, AK AQ*** crushes us (likely holdings imo) and even Ax beats us. What I mean is unless you know villian is capable of 4 bet jamming pretty light (rare at lower stakes) KQ basically goes WAY down in value. I see fish make this mistake all the time because they think well KQ is a "good" hand. Well yea it is, but not all-in preflop deep stacked.
Another reason I'd fold is the types of hands we'd crush with KQ likely wouldn't be 4 bet by this opponent. I.e. KJ, KT, K9, K8, QJ, QT, Q9, ect.
Finally, i'd probly snap fold for image reasons. If we insta-fold, he will think we 3 bet him with a very weak hand and early on like this we want the opponent to think that so we can get more value later with a big hand when we 3 bet.
I tried to just do cliff notes...hope I answered your question as clearly as I could.
Just going through your series. Brilliant and helped explain things so clearly in your simple and plain teaching method.
In your series you advocate raising <30 BB's to 3X pre flop and don't mention his min raising here? - Is there a difference?
Also at the end he's 33 big blinds deep and shoves over the opening raise with A8s? what is wrong will folding here and waiting for a better spot? Villian opening raises are bigger and more frequent but is that not similar to your thoughts when you mention that with lots of 3bets in a row you should give credit and not automatically think villain in weak? Sorry if it's a daft uestion but just trying to get my head around things.
Comments
great video! Think this might
great video!
Think this might be the donk bet video you mention:
http://www.husng.com/content/mjw006-how-play-against-donk-bets-heads-up-poker
Nice vid , i get confuse in
Nice vid , i get confuse in the calculation of how much % you need to call you bb versu 100 % raise , will you post the formule for thas plz
ty
Im not sure what you are
Im not sure what you are asking.
Hi waldi191, very nice video,
Hi waldi191,
very nice video, but I have one question.
13:30 min: What is the plan if villain raises or shoves on the 3bet KQs hand?
Thx for the answer
KQs
When we 3 bet here, we are 3-betting for value because he likely calls too wide facing 3 bets and our hand is strong AND flops VERY well. However if the opponent 4 bets us here, I ,personally, would snap fold.
We've only played 5 hands with no past history, and usually a random opponents' 4 betting range 50 BBs deep crushes KQ (even if its a small size (sometimes VERY VERY strong)). We pretty much can't beat anything if he shoves. 22-AA have us beat, AK AQ*** crushes us (likely holdings imo) and even Ax beats us. What I mean is unless you know villian is capable of 4 bet jamming pretty light (rare at lower stakes) KQ basically goes WAY down in value. I see fish make this mistake all the time because they think well KQ is a "good" hand. Well yea it is, but not all-in preflop deep stacked.
Another reason I'd fold is the types of hands we'd crush with KQ likely wouldn't be 4 bet by this opponent. I.e. KJ, KT, K9, K8, QJ, QT, Q9, ect.
Finally, i'd probly snap fold for image reasons. If we insta-fold, he will think we 3 bet him with a very weak hand and early on like this we want the opponent to think that so we can get more value later with a big hand when we 3 bet.
I tried to just do cliff notes...hope I answered your question as clearly as I could.
---Waldie
Yeah that was a good
Yeah that was a good explanation, thanks for that.
And on the flop, after we made a cbet, if he raise, do you fold there too?
Thanks a lot for the answer.
Jakester Leak Finder
Just going through your series. Brilliant and helped explain things so clearly in your simple and plain teaching method.
In your series you advocate raising <30 BB's to 3X pre flop and don't mention his min raising here? - Is there a difference?
Also at the end he's 33 big blinds deep and shoves over the opening raise with A8s? what is wrong will folding here and waiting for a better spot? Villian opening raises are bigger and more frequent but is that not similar to your thoughts when you mention that with lots of 3bets in a row you should give credit and not automatically think villain in weak? Sorry if it's a daft uestion but just trying to get my head around things.
Thanks again great job.
Lee