Slight calculation error,     hey guys, I just wanted to let you know that in this re-shoving equation in the video, it should be WIN 1050 or LOSE 950 , not WIN 1000 or LOSE 950,  so please if your going to be using it, or a similar version of it, make this adjustment

This is pulled from a 2p2 post of mine, but the general equation will look SOMETHING like this:

(the numbers from the equation below don't relate to this video at all)

%fold * $wonF + [ %called * %W * $wonC + %L * $lostC ]
(.809 * 150) + [ ( (.191) * (.31 * 1050) + (.69 * -950) ) ]

terms: $wonF = Money Won when they Fold
%called = Percentage called
%W = Percentage your hand wins vs their range (or the equity your hand has vs their range)
%L = 1-%W (or the equity their range has vs your hand)
$wonC = Money won when called and you win
$lostC = Money lost when called and you lose

Hey primo, I was just wondering if the equation u used in this vid can be adopted to open shoving the btn?

I ask because im normally a 9-18 man reg and use the program "sngwiz" alot for equity cals and did the numbers on the following situation to check out how ur equation stacks up:

blinds 50/100

btn - Hero (800 chips),  cards = JTs

bb - Villan (2200 chips),  call range = 46.3% (i chose this range as this gives EV = 0 in ur eq)

Note: TJs wins 40.9% against 25% range (pokerstove)

using ur equation:

EV = (vil_fold_%)*(chips won)   +   (vil_call_%) * [ (Hero_win_%)*(chips won) + (Hero_los_%)*(chips lost) ]

      = 0.537*100  +  0.463 * [ (0.409*800) + (0.591*-750) ]

      = 0 approx.   (doesnt seem right to start with to fold JTs with 8bb to call range > 46%, sage says shove also)

Using equity approach as in sngwiz:

Hero folds................................................. equity = 750/3000 = 25%

Hero shove, villan folds.......................... equity = 900/3000 = 30%

Hero shoves, Villan calls, hero win...... equity = 1600/3000 = 53.3%

Hero shoves, villan calls, villan wins... equity = 0%

Equity when hero shove = (vil_fold_% * equity)  +  vil_call_% * [ (hero_win_%)*(equity) + (hero_los_%)*(equity) ]

                                            =  (0.537*30) + 0.463*[ (0.409*53.3) + 0 ]

                                            = 26.2%

Equity when hero folds  = 25%

Equity diff = +1.2%    (sngwiz gives 2.2%, this is different as i used pokerstoves win % and sngwiz has this built in)

+1.2% is quite big and sngwiz is telling me to shove 100% with JTs against all calling ranges.

Along with this situation i have been looking at others and it seems this equation and sngwiz just dont match up. And yes i do have it on chip equity mode in sngwiz.

Am i missing some fundemental issue here or what?

Sorry... JTs wins 47.6% against a 46.3 calling range (not 40.9% as shown in my last comment, my bad)

which make some of the numbers there wrong but the concet is still valid and sngwiz and ur equation still dont match up.

also when he folds, you are winning 150 chips (his BB + your SB) , not just 100, and again, when you get called and win, you win 850 chips, not 800 (this is what I had said in my first post about the error of the equation that I gave),   so change those 2 numbers, and I believe your equation should be correct

with these changes sngwiz and the equation are now matching quite well... only some small differences due to the different ways the had equities are calculated. Which is great news cos i didnt know what to think for a sec there.

Thanks m8.

anytime :)

Just watched this and has possibly answered my question on what to do for a player who tightens up his range <20BB, when I play Nash this kind of feels like I get beat too often. 

Changing my play up and down seems like a good idea whilst not straying to far from Nash

Hi wayneking,

i am a 9man sng player too, and think your sngwiz result is ok in this situation.

but much more easy to use in those <7 BB situations, is the SAGE System by Lee jones.

(look at the article in cardplayer about it).

good luck

Greetings Primo,

I just wanted to give you some more feedback.  At first I found the last concept a little overwhelming, but you made it understandable by using a lot of examples.  It's awesome that you don't assume your audience is going to immediately grasp some of these concepts, as this material is foreign to some of us (or we aren't as adept at math).

I was making this some of these same plays on an intuitive level, without knowing the exact math, and found this discussion really useful.  It took me a while to get to the advanced section, and I'm happy I watched a lot of your other videos (and the other HUSNG coaches) beforehand.   Thanks for giving me such a strong foundation.  Your videos really are well-organized and you move at a nice pace.  Furthermore, as I've stated before, I appreciate your sensitivity to the fact that people have different learning styles.  You're a great teacher.

Thank you,

Jeffrey (five stars)

another great video primo but to coin your phase im being a spastard with regards to the win$ figure and lose $ figure I cant seem to get my head round it.I can do the rest perfectly. Can someone please explain this bit like im five say at 50/100BB with 1000 Effect Stacks. I'll post this in the video discussion section too.

cheers

Paul

Question to Primo or/and anyone who's been doing reshoving calculations. 

Let's take first example, around 12:43 in the video. 

We are 20bb deep (1000 @25/50 effective).
Villain is min raising 60% OTB.
He will call a shove with 12.8% of hands: 66+, A7s+, A8o+, KQs, KQo.
We have T8o.

So he will fold to a shove and we will win 150 chips right there (.6-.128)/.6=0.7867% of the time.
He'll call a shove 1-.7867=0.2133% of the time.
When he calls we'll win .32% of the time and we should win 2000 chips.
When he calls we'll lose .68% of the time and we should lose 950 chips.

(0.7867*150)+(0.2133*((0.32*2000)+(0.68*-950)))=116.7252

Why the amount we'll win when he calls in your example is 1000 instead of 2000? I mean, eff stacks is 1000, so we put 1000 of our stack preflop and villain puts 1000 of his stack preflop. Total pot postflop is 2000 and winner takes it all.

its the amount of chips we profit, and the amount of chips we risk, we win a pot of 2000, but only 1050 of that is profit (his stack + our blind), so we win 1050, not 2000